`N&V-L Digests 494 - 505 July 1999`

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--------------------------- N&V-L Digest 495 2 Jul 1999 ---------------------------

............................................................... I had a terrible education. I attended a school for emotionally disturbed teachers. --Woody Allen ...............................................................

There are 10 messages in this digest.

1. TV show - English Forever 2. Figuritas and Michigan Proficiency 3. Michigan Proficiency 4. FTBE - revised posting 5. Dulce de leche and empanadas 6. Another language query 7. Food for thought 8. About 'dulce de leche' 9. Another FTBE Course 10. Wanted - info on legal English

** ---------------------------- 1. TV show - English Forever ----------------------------

A year or so ago a new cable television show was announced in Argentina, an English course being sold under the name 'English Forever'. It was to be put out weekly on Cablevision, Multicanal and Cablesaber (CVSat 26) and was said to consist of broadcasts at three levels + 'complementary material'.

Does anyone know anything else about this ? Did it actually get to be shown ? Has anyone seen ity ? Any comments ? Who produced it ? Where can I find out more ?

Any info much appreciated

Posted by: Martin Eayrs mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

** ------------------------------------- 2. Figuritas and Michigan Proficiency -------------------------------------

Figuritas:

Funnily enough a friend of mine who works as a translator in the U.S. asked me if "figuritas" would be a good Spanish translation for "trading cards". Her query came in connection with the on coming launch of Pokemon trading cards in the Latin American market. Be on the look out, whatever they look like when they come out here, that's a trading card.

Michigan Proficiency:

ICANA used to be a local representative of that exam in the past. They might still be. I took it there 20 years ago. They also prepared students for it as they did for TOEFL.

Posted by: Cecilia Macchi mailto:cemacchi@sicoar.com

** ----------------------- 3. Michigan Proficiency -----------------------

Not very popular...only heard about it 10 years ago at Asociacion Mendocina de intercambio cultural argentino norteamericano, AMICANA. I know it was given there...I don't know if they still offer it

Cheers,

posted by: Daniela Forquera Neuquen - Argentina mailto:danielafo@pop3.arnet.com.ar

** ------------------------- 4. FTBE - revised posting -------------------------

The following item is being reposted as it contained a typing error in the contact i formation.

CAIT - Approved Training Centre by the LCCIEB- is arranging a 50-hour Intensive Week Course which covers all the issues related to the Foundation Certificate for Teachers of Business English (FTBE)

From July 6th to July 24th. Vacancies are limited.

The FTBE is an award for qualified general EFL practising teachers who intend to specialise in teaching English for business purposes and has been developed by the London Chamber of Commerce and Industry Examinations Board (LCCIEB).

For a free screening test and more information, call 4311-8544 or 4314-2583.

Posted by: Alejandra M. Jorge CAIT- Director of Studies Maipú 863 3º C (1006) Capital Federal - Argentina mailto:cait@ciudad.com.ar

** ------------------------------- 5. Dulce de leche and empanadas -------------------------------

"Milk jelly", the translation Havana (the alfajores maker) chose to print on the tins of dulce de leche does not make much sense to my NNS "feeling" for English. Does it to the NSs who are familiar with dulce de leche?

I have seen "Milk Jam," also, but neither that term nor "Milk Jelly" is especially appealing to me. Jam and jelly imply something made from fruit (to my Texan mind, anyway). "Caramel Spread" is better, although caramel is common in the U.S. and , while similar, is not the same. The best option, as with most food items that are not common in the target language, seems to be to use the original term, in italics or quotes, and explain its meaning.

As for the word "empanada," I would offer the following possibilities as well: pastry and turnover. The Mexican empanada, made from fruit, is translated as turnover. Pastry is a more general term which can be applied to many kinds of baked items.

Hope this helps.

Timothy C. Archer IICANA/Cerro mailto:cerro@iicana.com

** ------------------------- 6. Another language query -------------------------

Could anybody translate these phrases ?

"...meathead mind..." "...more patriotic than the guin..." "The whole thing was a cruel little s-m gimmick..."

Posted by: Mabel Bras de Sarlinga mailto:sarbras@rcc.com.ar

** ------------------ 7. Food for thought -------------------

These two items of news appeared in the Multilingual Matters Language & Education News, to which I am subscribed, in Issue 4 1999. Should anybody like to contact them, just let me know.

NEWS FROM THE USA Anti-Bilingual Movement Spreads by James Crawford

A new campaign to eliminate bilingual education in the USA has targeted Arizona as the next battleground. English-only proponents hope to force a referendum there next year, modelled on California's Proposition 227, which would ban native-language instruction for virtually all public- school children with limited English proficiency. In Arizona, these students include not only speakers of Spanish and Asian languages, but also a substantial number of Native Americans including Navajo, Tohono O'odh am, Yaqui, and Hualapai whose ancestral tongues are threatened with extinction.

EMANCIPATORY MAORI EDUCATION: SPEAKING FROM THE HEART Arohia Durie Massey University College of Education, Palmerston North, New Zealand. As Maori, the indigenous people of Aotearoa/New Zealand, take back responsibility and control over the provision of education for Maori, efforts are entering an exciting phase. The empowering potential of recent community initiatives, in conjunction with the re-emergence of tribal and urban Maori authorities, have established an infrastructure well positioned to facilitate progressive educational provision for Maori. Once formal education is conceived of as an empowering rather than a subordinating process, an important barrier to success will be overcome. Central to that conception is the promotion of the Maori language as the medium of instruction, together with issues of control, negotiation and a continued expansion of Maori models of teaching and learning. A greater adaptation of generic (western) models towards appropriate accommodation of the educational needs of Maori learners is a further dimension. The initiatives taken by one tribal authority are examined against the role taken by similar authorities in educational planning and provision. Language revitalisation is seen to be integral to a strong cultural identity and enhanced well-being.

Posted by: Alejandra M. Jorge CAIT- Head of Studies mailto:cait@ciudad.com.ar

** ------------------------- 8. About 'dulce de leche' -------------------------

While in the UK I had a bite in a hamburger shop - I forget which - and ordered a caramelled iceceam and, guess what? It tasted very much like our 'dulce de leche'!

Posted by: Graciela I. Castelli Colegio San Bartolome Rosario mailto:colsanbartolome@arnet.com.ar

** ---------------------- 9. Another FTBE Course ----------------------

CENTUM - Approved Training Centre by the LCCIEB - announces a 50-hour course for teachers, leading to the Foundation Certificate for Teachers of Business English (FTBE). The FTBE is an internationally valid teaching qualification.

From August 6th to November 19th, on Fridays, from 2:00 to 5:00 pm.

The course includes needs analysis, basic concepts in business, vocabulary, written communications and teaching techniques for tailor-making. It is taught by Roy Gooding, Andrew Blair and Ana Maria Bergel.

For information contact CENTUM, 4328-2385, centum@datamarkets.com.ar

Posted by: Ana Maria Bergel mailto:centum@datamarkets.com.ar

** ---------------------------------- 10. Wanted - info on legal English ----------------------------------

Dear people:

I have to teach english for legal purposes to a beginner student who has to participate in a mediation-negociation at the end of the year.

I´d like to receive suggestions about books, or web pages

Posted by: Graciela Luisa Jankielzon Colombres 872 - Lomas de Zamora mailto:haf@satlink.com.ar

**

end

----------------------------- N&V-L Digest 496 - 3 Jul 1999 -----------------------------

.................................................................. Education is not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire.

--William Butler Yeats ..................................................................

There are 7 messages in this digest.

1. Texts for Legal English 2. Catenatives 3. Course in Moron, July 4. TV Show - English Forever 5. Coordinating Successfully - repeated 6. Dulce de Leche ice cream 7. Help needed on the Internet

** -------------------------- 1. Texts for Legal English --------------------------

I have to teach english for legal purposes to a beginner student who has to participate in a mediation-negociation at the end of the year.

I´d like to receive suggestions about books, or web pages

Here are some suggestions from earlier correspondence on N&V-L on this thread.

'Wiley's English/Spanish and Spanish/English Legal Dictionary' by Steven M. Kaplan

'Your Handbook of Everyday Law' by George Gordon Coughlin, Jr .- Harper Perennial

'Eddey on the English Legal System' by Penny Darbyshire - Sweet & Maxwell

'A Guide to Court Systems' - Institute of Judicial Administration - Washington

Codes of Criminal Procedure, Code of Civil Procedure, Constitutions, documents from the International Court of Justice, ( USA) etc.

Black's Law Dictionary (1983) - Campbell Black, Henry, M.A. Abridged Fifth Edition. St Paul, Minn. West Publishing Co.

English for Law, Riley, A. Prentice Hall

Law Today, Powell, R. Addison Wesley/Longman

English Law and language. Russell, F. & Locke, C Prentice Hall

Dictionary of Law, Peter Collin

Check Your Vocabulary for Law, Peter Collin

Mellinkoff's Dictionary of American Legal Usage (1992, West Publishing)

Real Life Dictionary of the Law" (1997, General Publishing Group)

Dictionary of Legal Terms" (1993, Barron's)

American Language Review has published a number of articles on Legal English (including legal dictionary reviews by Chris Feak and Sue Reinhart of the University of Michigan). You can find them in the archives section (May/June '97, Jan/Feb '98, Jul/yAug '98) at http://www.alr.org

Have a look too at http://dumblaws.com

Posted by: List Editor mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

** -------------- 2. Catenatives --------------

I wrote in a posting I sent today to TESL-L

>As the Cornishman walks north-east he will slowly realise that >the way the people he meets speak changes.

I was going to edit this before sending but then I decided not too - to me it is perfectly good spoken English, if perhaps a little confusing when written as one tends to 'close' after each verb form. But it's what I wrote, and I let it go, no disrespect implied to TESL-L and its members.

However, catenatives like this are not all that common. Strangely, I heard another only today:

"...the sink keeps getting clogged up"

I can also attest to the following comment (made about some screams, by curious coincidence also in the kitchen):

"I might have been being raped for all you care".

which I think is a very uncommon verb form and the only one of its kind (AUX + 'have' + 'been' + 'being' + past participle) that I have ever heard (or at least registered) used spontaneously and unselfconsciously.

I wonder:

a) if other list members would accept/reject these ?

b) how you might present them, if at all, to advanced learners ?

c) if anyone has similar (authentic, not invented) examples

Posted by:Martin Eayrs mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

** ------------------------ 3. Course in Moron, July ------------------------

Roads to English in Morón, Pce. of Buenos Aires announces the following meetings for English teachers during the July holidays:

Saturday July 17th (14:00-17:00) Mercedes Rossetti Designing your own materials for your needs.

Friday July 23rd(14:00-17:00) María Laura Rossi, Mónica Aparicio Make your own games

Friday July 30th (14:00-17:00) Mercedes Rossetti What can I do with electronic mail and Internet?

Registration at Librería Rauch Tel.: 4629-3082 Cost: $ 10 Folders with bibliography and material and refreshments provided. Raffles.

Posted by: Mercedes Rossetti http://members.xoom.com/project_2000 mailto:mrossetti@impsat1.com.ar

** ---------------------------- 4. TV Show - English Forever ----------------------------

The programme was on for two years, until March l998. Economic problems after that. Produced by Alejandra and Juan Carlos Ottolina - Santa Monica School of Languages 011-4-241-2667

Posted by: Mirta Arzamendia Richmond Publishing mailto:MArzamendia@santillana.com.ar

** --------------------------------------- 5. Coordinating Successfully - repeated ---------------------------------------

The seminar "Coordinating Successfully is being repeated on Saturday July 17. The session is directed at Coordinators, Directors, Directors of Studies and English teachers. Contents include: recruiting, interviewing techniques, training, observation of classes, appraisals, motivation and incentives for teachers, coping with difficult personalities and leadership.

If you mention N&V-LV on the application form you will receive a discount on registration . Further information: Güemes 4252 (1425), City of Buenos Aires Tel/fax: 4 832-3000 <p://www.educa.com.ar/abs>ww>.educa.com.ar/abs E-mail: <mailto:lewin@einstein.com.ar>lewin@einstein.com.ar

Posted by: Laura Lewin mailto:lewin@einstein.com.ar

** --------------------------- 6. Dulce de Leche ice cream ----------------------------

About dulce de leche, Haagen Dasz Icecreams has a new flavour in the US and its called DULCE DE LECHE and underneath that it says CARAMEL.

Best wishes

Posted by: Connie F. de Bellocq mailto:jbellocq@waycom.com.ar

** ------------------------------ 7. Help needed on the Internet ------------------------------

If anybody could give me a hint on how to surf in the net with small groups of children and teenagers during the English lesson, I would be very grateful. I find myself at a loss with respect to the methodology to be used, always keeping a pedagogical aim in mind and not letting them surf freely and waste class time.

Thank you.

Posted by: Adriana V. Maddaloni mailto:maddadri@satlink.com.ar

**

end

----------------------------- N&V-L Digest 497 - 4 Jul 1999 -----------------------------

................................................................ Sixty years ago I knew everything; now I know nothing; Education is the progressive discovery of our ignorance. --Will Durant .................................................................

There are 4 messages in this digest.

1. Problems for very advanced learners 2. Request for more information 3. Agenda Vs. schedule 4. Info needed on TOEFL

** -------------------------------------- 1. Problems for very advanced learners --------------------------------------

I am interested in problems that very advanced learners of English might still have with the language.

The kind of learner I have in mind would have a high TOEFL/Michigan Proficiency score, or a good Cambridge Proficiency Pass, but would still have a few problems left to be ironed out. He/she might perhaps be a NNS teacher of English, a translator or at the least a highly proficient user.

My intutition is that problems facing this kind of learner would fall into the main areas of register, collocation and idiomatic usage, with a handful of structural areas and I am currently involved in producing materials on this basis. But I would be interested in any input as to specific 'areas' or 'items' that constitute 'lingering doubts' or 'pitfalls' long after reaching a high degree of proficiency.

My main target here is speakers of English with a background in Spanish or other romance languages, but any general insight would also be useful, on the grounds that not all learning problems are caused by L1 interference, some seemingly being caused by the nature of the English language.

There are undoubtedly members of this list who fall into the category I mention and they may well be able to identify specific difficulties that they have difficulties in resolving. I am not so much concerned with specific items - such as the use of 'being this Tuesday...' instead of 'this being Tuesday..' - as the identification of areas which could serve as the basis for materials production.

Any suggestions will be acknowledged and I shall of course summarise to the list any useful input.

Posted by:Martin Eayrs mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

------------------------------- 2. Request for more information -------------------------------

In connection with Mabel Bras's request for the translation of 3 phrases in English

> "...meathead mind..." > "...more patriotic than the guin..." > "The whole thing was a cruel little s-m gimmick..."

I think I'd like to give it a try, if only she would

a) provide more of a context. Otherwise, it's kind of risky, isn't it? b) explain why she needs the translation.

Posted by: María Andrea Morales mailto:ariales@neuquen.com.ar

** ---------------------- 3. Agenda Vs. schedule ----------------------

What's the actual difference between agenda and schedule?

Thank you!

Regards,

Posted by: Maria Elisa Suarez mailto:mariaelisa@arnet.com.ar

**

----------------------- 4. Info needed on TOEFL -----------------------

I need info about TOEFL urgently!!!!

I have already contacted the address in their brochure and they have told me to contact the centre in Argentina. (whose address is not in the brochure, just the provinces where one can take it)

Posted by Marcela Burgos mailto:ieli@imagine.com.ar

**

end

------------------------------ N&V-L Digest 498 - 11 Jul 1999 ------------------------------ ............................................................... Prejudices, it is well known, are most difficult to eradicate from the heart whose soil has never been loosened or fertilized by education; they grow there, firm as weeds among stones.

--Charlotte Bronte ...............................................................

There are 5 messages in this digest.

1. Studying Abroad: Mission... Possible ? 2. Expansion of language query 3. Visiting Buenos Aires 4. Reading and writing for 6-year-olds 5. Web sites wanted for advanced students

** ----------------------------------------- 1. Studying Abroad: Mission... Possible ? -----------------------------------------

What: "Studying Abroad: Mission... Possible?" A Question & Answer session with Analia Kandel and Florencia Franceschina

When: Wednesday, July 14 -- 10 to 11am

Where: Auditorium (2nd floor) Instituto Nacional Superior del Profesorado Tecnico / Universidad Tecnologica Nacional Av. Triunvirato 3174 Capital Federal Tel: 4553-3198 / 4554-1667/4037 / 4552-4176/6027

In order to end the term on an optimistic note, I have asked Analia Kandel and Florencia Franceschina, who have done MA courses at the University of Reading and the University of Essex respectively, to share their personal experiences and perceptions about what studying abroad involves (mainly focusing on academic and practical issues) and answer questions from students / EFL teachers who may wish to take up postgraduate studies (abroad or by distance study) in the future. The meeting will centre on the key question "Is it possible?". All welcome.

Posted by: Maria Isabel Copello Head of the English Department Instituto Nacional Superior del Profesorado Tecnico / Universidad Tecnologica Nacional mailto:profesores@fibertel.com.ar

** ------------------------------ 2. Expansion of language query ------------------------------

In response to:

In connection with Mabel Bras's request for the translation of 3 phrases in English

> "...meathead mind..." > "...more patriotic than the guin..." > "The whole thing was a cruel little s-m gimmick..."

I think I'd like to give it a try, if only she would

a) provide more of a context. Otherwise, it's kind of risky, isn't it? b) explain why she needs the translation.

Hello, I´m Mabel´s daughter and I´m reading a book called "Dog Day Afternoon". In the first brief, the central character is in an interview to take a job in a Bank.

"...I believed what I read in the newspapers. I was a loyal Republican, too. I believed my President. They told me things and I did what I was supposed to do, I volunteered. Call it patriotic. I´m half italian and there´s nobody more patriotic than the guin - I mean, you know. Three long years. Purple Heart twice..."

Here, the central character is at the waiting room, after having spoken with the woman.

"None of them had a chance. There was no job. The whole thing was a cruel little s-m gimmick to let Miss Wetmouth get off her rocks making people crawl. He´d love to humiliate her the way she´d just humiliated him."

Here he is making a description of his family.

"She used the kids like clubs, slamming his head with them, calling him selfish and a rotten father and a lousy provider and all the garbage that collect in ther meathead mind, spilling all over him, and the kids watching their old man eat shit until he couldn´t take it any more and just took off for a bar somewhere."

It is an original version not a simplified edition so it has many difficult expressions to understand.

Thanks for helping me...!!!

Posted by: Mariel Sarlinga mailto:sarbras@rcc.com.ar

** ------------------------ 3. Visiting Buenos Aires ------------------------

Dear Colleagues,

My name's Silvana Bastino and I'm an English Teacher in Villa María - Córdoba. I own an English Institute here and work with different levels and age groups. I'd like to take a group of students - teenagers and adults- to Buenos Aires for a tour in English over a weekend in August or September. I'd greatly appreciate your sending me any information, if available, as regards travel agencies or people who are in charge of this kind of activity and who are really trustworthy. I appreciate your help and thank you in advance.

Sincerely,

Posated by: Silvana Bastino Bv. alvear 41 (5900) Villa María (Cba.) mailto:englishonline@infovia.com.ar

** -------------------------------------- 4. Reading and writing for 6-year-olds --------------------------------------

Teaching to read and write in English at the age of 6 years old.

I'd appreciate some advice from experienced teachers for children about the convenience or not to teach reading and writing to a group of first graders who have 2 and 3 hours of English a week. As they are learning to read and write in Spanish, they are eager to write even in English, and they send "letters" written as they pronounce." Thank you for your help.

Posted by: María Elena de Herrero mailto:herreromec@lared.com.ar

** ----------------------------------------- 5. Web sites wanted for advanced students -----------------------------------------

I need good web sites for advanced students who want to use the Internet to improve their language. Exercises, games, interesting things, places where they can contact other students, whatever.

Can anybody help me out?

Thanks.

Posted by: Connie Bellocq mailto:jbellocq@waycom.com.ar

**

end

------------------------------ N&V-L Digest 499 - 13 Jul 1999 ------------------------------

There are 5 messages in this digest.

1. Some ELT Websites 2. Re: Mabel Bra's language query 3. Should authors be paid for articles ? 4. Ref.: Info needed about TOEFL 5. Recent housekeeping message

** -------------------- 1. Some ELT Websites ---------------------

At the last LAURELS Conference in Uruguay last year, I was able to attend a lecture by Cindy Leaney. She gave us a list which has websites for students & teachers. I hope it helps you to find what you are looking for.

1. The English Country School- Project Ideas and links galore <http://www.countryschool.com>http://www.countryschool.com 2. Linguistic Funland- Links, games,etc. <http://www.linguistic-funland.com>http://www.linguistic-funland.com 3. Elaine's ESL/EFL pages for teachers & students- Lesson plans, readings, etc <http://mofetsrv.mofet.macam98.ac.il/~elaine/eti>http://mofetsrv.mofet .macam98.ac.il/~elaine/eti 4. USA Today's Slightly Off centre- Great human interest stories for intermediate advanced students <http://www.usatoday.com/news/nweird.htm>http://www.usatoday.com/news/ nweird.htm 5. CNN world News Fringe Stories- More strange human interest stories for reading and vocabulary extension.topics include Peru's ugliest dog, Quebec bureaucrats reject baby names <http://cnn.com/WORLD/indexhtml#fringe>http://cnn.com/WORLD/indexhtml# fringe (scroll to the bottom of the page) 6. A games site <http://eslgames.com>http://eslgames.com 7. John & Sarah's TEFL Pitstop- Ideas, lesson plans & keypals (penpals susbstitute) links <http://www.lingolex.com/jstefl.htm>http://www.lingolex.com/jstefl.htm 8. Dave's ESL Cafe- A very rich site which continuates to grow and change. Lots of activities for students, keypals access, resources for teachers, links galore <http://www.eslcafe.com>http://www.eslcafe.com 9. Longman Dictionaries Website- Teachers' lesson plans, student excercises, etc <http://www.awl-elt.com/dictionaries>http://www.awl-elt.com/dictionari es 10. Digital Educaton Network- Writing Workshop, ideas, lesson plans, TOEFL prep <http://www.actden.com>http://www.actden.com

I have visited most of them and they are very good. There are others but these are the most useful.

Posted by: Martin Inthamoussu mailto:inmir@adinet.com.uy

** --------------------------------- 2. Re: Mabel Bra's language query ---------------------------------

I can at least comment on "The whole thing was a cruel little s-m gimmick..."

s-m usually means sado-masochistic (but I have't read Dog Day Afternoon. Good movie tho!)

Posted by:Judy Garton-Sprenger mailto:JudyGS@compuserve.com

** ---------------------------------------- 3. Should authors be paid for articles ? ----------------------------------------

Dear all

I recently had an email from Martin, as many of you no doubt did, asking for an article for ELT News & Views. So far so good. My eyes stood out on stalks, though, when I read this bit:

and no, I'm sorry, we don't pay - this is a point of principle rather than a business decision.

'Oh' I thought, 'and what exactly is the point of principle that does not pay ELT professionals for their work ? I understand business decisions better than I understand such 'points of principle !'

There may be different angles on this and I thought it would make an interesting discussion on the list. Non-payment is, of course, quite a common thing in the profession, though it is not often raised to the heights of 'a point of principle.' Personally, I think we (the ELT community) ought to really have a look at how we view ourselves. Do I detect the faint whiff of a notion that somehow education is too 'pure' to be sullied by the filthy lucre ? Spare a thought for freelancers, who do not receive a monthly packet of the foul stuff........ I suppose I'm in the position of seeing payment for my work as BOTH a point of principle AND a business decision. Here are some other questions that come into my head:

- what effect would payment have on contributions ? - are we (the ELT community ) saying that we can't produce good, principled work AND be paid for it ?

Let's have a heated debate ! : ))))

Sue

Posted by: Sue Leather mailto:SueLeather@email.msn.com

** -------------------------------- 4. Ref.: Info needed about TOEFL --------------------------------

TOEFL Centre in Argentina:

ICANA Maipú 686 (1084) Buenos Aires Tel. 4 322-4557/3855

Posted by: Verónica R. Parsiale Bibliotecaria - National Resources Centre Asoc. Arg. de Cultura Inglesa mailto:biblioteca@aacibsas.org.ar

** ------------------------------ 5. Recent housekeeping message ------------------------------

The list editor would like to thank the many (thirty+ so far) mails of support for his work (and, let it be said, one of criticism !) that came in response to his outburst last Sunday concerning the ingratitude of certain list members.

Many of these mails were intended for posting on this list. Nevertheless, the list editor has taken the decision that it would not be productive to pursue this thread on N&V-L.

**

end

------------------------------ N&V-L Digest 500 - 14 Jul 1999 ------------------------------

................................................................ It's better to sit there and look stupid than to open your mouth and put the matter beyond doubt. --Yorkshire adage .................................................................

There are 4 messages in this digest.

1. Should authors be paid for articles ? 2. Workshop: Verbal and non-verbal Games 3. Teacher training Colleges in Argentina 4. Empanadas and other Argentine food

** ---------------------------------------- 1. Should authors be paid for articles ? -----------------------------------------

Sue Leather wrote that she was surprised ELT News & Views does not offer payment for articles. Frankly, I would be surprised if it did offer to pay.

Does anyone know of a profession which has professional journals which pay to receive contributions? Normally there is such competition to get your work published in the fields of medicine, biology, physics, etc., that there is a committee responsible for vetting all contributions and rejecting the majority which do not meet the norms required, or are not interesting or original enough for publication.

Those writers who are published are delighted just to see their works in print and some go to considerable personal expense to make sure their works are up to scratch. (e.g. I do a lot of translation work for professionals who want to publish their research or ideas, but feel their English is not quite good enough, and there are also many whose research grants are really not sufficient to cover all the time and effort they put in).

For ELT to be professionally recognised, we don't have to hold out for payment for papers submitted for publication - we need to push for professional rigour in the works that are published. (Not a heated debate but a cool-headed debate!)

Posted by: Joss Heywood mailto:jheywood@cordoba.com.ar

** ---------------------------------------- 2. Workshop: Verbal and non-verbal Games ----------------------------------------

Title: Verbal and non-verbal Games

Date: Friday 23 July 10 to 13

Fee: $15.

Vacancies: Limited

Venue: CR Inglés Ayacucho 610 San Antonio de Padua ( West of B.A) Buenos Aires

Lecturer: Cecilia Ramirez Current teacher of Language I and Methodology at Instituto del Profesorado, D.F. Sarmiento. Researching into the power of Music in Learning and Multiple Intelligences.

Enrolment 0220 4859714 & Info: 15 4 091 3773

We have more information in a Powerpoint File...E mail us and you will receive it.

thank you in advance

Posted by: Cecilia Ramirez mailto:cr@infovia.com.ar

** ----------------------------------------- 3. Teacher training Colleges in Argentina -----------------------------------------

A plea for professional solidarity !!

I am trying to piece together a list of teacher-training colleges in Argentina which train English teachers (at all levels). Since 'decentralisation' this is not an easy matter, as courses may open and close at any time and there seems to be no authoritative list to refer to.

If you know any that are not on the list below or can correct any of this information I should be grateful if you could send me details of 'what kind of course(s)' and 'how to contact the institution' (e.g. address, phone, fax and email).

Here is my list so far

Pr/ST Province Name of Institution ----- -------- -------------------

Private Buenos Aires ISP Juan XXIII (Bahía Blanca) Private Buenos Aires ISP Presb. Saenz (Lomas de Zamora) Private Buenos Aires St Trinnean's University College State Buenos Aires ENC 9 de Julio State Buenos Aires ISFD 16 Saladillo State Buenos Aires ISFD 23 Luján State Buenos Aires ISFD 78 Bragado State Buenos Aires ISFD No 24 Dr B A Houssay (Bernal) State Buenos Aires ISP Ciudad de Mercedes State Buenos Aires ISP Junín State Buenos Aires ISP Lincoln State Buenos Aires ISP Moreno State Buenos Aires ISP Olavarría State Buenos Aires ISP Pehuajó State Buenos Aires ISP Pergamino State Chaco ISP San Fernando Rey Private Chubut Instituto Patagónico de Profesores de Inglés State Chubut ISP Comodoro English Private City of Bs As Asociación Argentina de Cultura Inglesa Private City of Bs As Fundación Sallottiana/ Instituto Summa Private City of Bs As Instituto Cultural Argentino Norte-Americano Private City of Bs As IS Argentina 2000 Private City of Bs As IS Daguerre Private City of Bs As ISP Consudec Private City of Bs As St Catherine's College State City of Bs As IES en Lenguas Vivas J R Fernández State City of Bs As INSP Técnico State City of Bs As ISP Dr. J. V. González State City of Bs As ISP Esc.Sup. en Lenguas Vivas J. F.Kennedy State Córdoba ISP Villa María State Corrientes ISP J. Comtte State Entre Ríos IES María I Elizalda. State Entre Ríos IP de Concordia State Entre Ríos IP de Paran State Entre Ríos ISP de Entre Ríos State Jujuy ISP Jujuy Private La Pampa IP La Pampa State La Rioja IES de la Rioja State La Rioja ISP J M Estrada State La Rioja ISP William Shakespeare State Misiones ISP A. Ruiz Montoya Private Neuquén Inst. Neuquino de Prof. De Inglés Private Rio Negro IP Lenguas Vivas de Bariloche State Salta ISP de Salta State San Luis ISP San Luis State Santa Fe ISP Rosario State Santa Fe ISP Sta Fe State S del Estero ISFD No 1 Private T del Fuego IP Salesiano de Estudios Superiores

Information I am short of in many cases is the type of course(s) taught and the duration/number of hours in each case. Also of course some of these may have closed down (or lo longer be offering 'English' courses and there may be others that I am not aware of or have left off the list accidentally.

I shall shortly be posting a similar list of courses in National, Provincial and Private Universities for list members' comments.

A plea of solidarity here to ELT professionals around the country. It's good to share this kind of information but it's good to to help in collecting it !

Thanks to you all

Martin Eayrs

Posted by: Martin Eayrs mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

** ------------------------------------- 4. Empanadas and other Argentine food -------------------------------------

I've been following the comments on dulce de leche/empanadas with interest, thinking all along that the problem may be one of trying to render regional Spanish into general English. The solution might well be to render regional Spanish into regional English. Here goes my comment on empanadas. (I'm leaving dulce de leche to a more knowledgeable and sweet-toothed commentator.)

Americans living in Panama, in contact with Panamanian Spanish, where the form empanadas is used, called them empanadas, simply, supposedly because they were unable to find an exact equivalent in their varieties of English.

But in Caribbean (specifically Jamaican) English, there is a form that is an equivalent. It is patty, which, as the Dictionary of Jamaican English (Cambridge, Cambridge University Press, 1967) by F. G. Cassidy and R. B. Le Page informs, is attested in the OED in 1870. The two lexicographers define it as "A semicircular pastry made by folding a circle of pastry upon itself over a filling of ground meat, fruit paste, or the like. (Also called a tart when made with fruit.)".

The more recent Dictionary of Caribbean English Usage (edited by Richard Allsopp; Oxford, Oxford University Press, 1996) clarifies that the form is used in Jamaica and that, in Guyana, it refers to "A small, round, meat-filled pastry with crimped edge; it is often used as a cocktail appetizer." This sounds deliciously like certain forms of Argentine empanadas, which, by the way come in types and shapes that vary according to their region of origin.

In Anne Wilson's Cocina escocesa (Könemann, Colonia, 1997. Translated by Elena Puentas from the original Scottish Cooking), there are some forfar bridies on p. 17. The pictures show some finger-licking empanadas.

I trust this helps out. Happy translating, and, better yet, happy eating.

Posted by: Martin Jamieson American English Institute mailto:jamieson@arnet.com.ar

**

end

------------------------------ N&V-L Digest 501 - 19 Jul 1999 ------------------------------

.............................................................. Education is what survives when what has been learned has been forgotten. -- B.F. SKINNER ..............................................................

There are 4 messages in this digest.

1. Should authors be paid for articles ? 2. Should authors be paid for articles ? 3. Looking for Burlington books 4. N&V-L splits into two ...

** ---------------------------------------- 1. Should authors be paid for articles ? -----------------------------------------

As for the person who feels offended for not being offered payment for an article, where has she been living lately? I'd sure have a shock if I was offered payment! I totally agree with Joss Heywood's mail. Nobody is going to offer you money for an article in such prestigious journals as Language Learning, SSLA (Studies in Second Language Acquisition) or MLJ. None of these journals (including ELT News) are published in order to make money, but for the community to share their ideas and for new discoveries to be publicised.

I personally feel that this thing about getting published has gone a bit overboard, in that everybody is soooo desperate to get published. You can't just be good at what you do, you have to show it as well by publishing about it. If you have no publications in refereed journals, you have very little chance of getting the good jobs within academia.

And getting published is not a one-step process either. You first send your article, it gets reviewed annonimously by (at least) two independent referees, they send it back to you for corrections (and some times they send it back to you saying this is no-good, do it again and we might be interested), you send it back with corrections, they send it back, etc. It can take more than a year between the time you send it first and the time it gets published, IF it ever gets published.

And it's not only you, the writer, who's not getting any money for it. The reviewers don't get any money for it, the editor doesn't get any money for it (and see how you would feel after going through 300 articles in a semester, making comments about each of them) and neither of the members of the board of directors get any money for it

Posted by: Nadine Laporte mailto:n.i.laporte@bangor.ac.uk

*** ---------------------------------------- 2. Should authors be paid for articles ? -----------------------------------------

I have to admit to fully agreeing with Joss's recent posting, in which he disparages some (apparently) widely-held views regarding payment, or actually non-payment, of professional pieces in likewise, professional journals. There is a further issue if one really feels like delving into the matter which is, how much is enough? What criteria, if any, justify paying an "equal amount for equal effort?" Is length alone really an adequate yardstick? If not, under what circumstances might we feel tempted to pay, say, 20% more? (or less?). Who will finance said expenditure in an otherwise money-free listing?

I for my part do not feel entitled to any form of financial redress in return for this piece or any other of the (so far) very few that I have submitted; quite the contrary, I welcome the existence of an area of (relatively) free speech where I can collaborate on a voluntary basis with others who, like myself, do their professional jobs for professional money somewhere else. If there is anyone out there who is "on the web" for the money, please let me know, I get off at the next exit!

In short: if what you're looking for is the moolah, work your ass off at a regular job like the rest of us!

Posted by: Ezequiel D. Cantón mailto:zekefreak@infovia.com

** ------------------------------- 3. Looking for Burlington books -------------------------------

I have recently heard of an ELT publisher called 'Burlington Books'. Does any list member know anything about them or where they can be contacted ?

Posted by: Martin Eayrs mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

** ---------------------------- 4. N&V-L splits into two ... ----------------------------

As part of a long planned expansion N&V-L will be splitting into two lists in a couple of months' time. Some words of explanation may be of interest at this time.

N&V-L was originally started as a news, information and discussion list for teachers of English in Cono Sur countries. However, as time went by, it gradually became a predominantly Argentine list and we have gradually lost members from Cono Sur countries outside Argentina as they see little or no news about their own countries.

In order to address this situation I have decided to open up a new list, aimed specifically at teachers of English in Brazil. This means that there will soon be an 'A' list and a 'B' list - the letters refer to Argentina and Brazil, not to relative importance :-)

Existing members of N&V-L will remain on the original list - the only difference is that the name will change, probably to N&V/a-L, and it will become explicitly recognised that this is a list relating to ELT in Argentina.

A completely new list will start up, probably called N&V/b-L, which will function in exactly the same way as the existing list but will be aimed at ELT in Brazil.

Anyone will be able to join or leave either list, both, or none, at any time. There may be some overlap of content but this is unavoidable. Both lists will continue to be free (you don't have to pay) and to be run as non-commercial lists (no overt advertising). They will also continue to be moderated.

As I said, this split will not happen for a couple of months but if you would like your name to be added to the Brazil list (N&V/b-L) from the very beginning you can send me a mail with the subject header

'Subscribe N&V-L Brazil'

and I shall mail you back in time with further details.

Please Fwd. this information to anyone you feel may be interested.

Posted by: List Editor mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

**

end ------------------------------ N&V-L Digest 502 - 26 Jul 1999 ------------------------------

........................................................... Only the educated are free. -- EPICTETUS ...........................................................

There are 5 messages in this digest.

1. Should authors be paid for articles ? 2. Pronunciation preferences 3. Request for info on joint ventures in Argentina 4. Should authors be paid for articles ? 5. ELT Jobs in the new year

** ---------------------------------------- 1. Should authors be paid for articles ? -----------------------------------------

I was very interested in the debate on payment for writers of articles and its various spin-offs. Allow me to make a few points:

It is very true, as Joss and Nadine point out, that serious academic journals do not offer payment for articles published in them. It is also true that in academia we tend to find a "publish or perish" situation where individuals (and whole departments) are assessed on the basis of their publication output. I actually disagree with Nadine as to the disadvantages of such system, at least in principle. If the final "product" is to be of interest and value to colleagues, it should be the best it can be. Without this sort of "quality control" the publication cannot be guaranteed to be as "valuable", and this is precisely why publications in non-refereed journals are not awarded as many "points" at the time of review as those in refereed journals.

Notice the prolific use of inverted commas. This is because this area is open to a serious debate as to the nature of gate-keeping in academia, and to what extent it is not a case of self-perpetuation and keeping people and ideas out. It is a premise of such a debate, however, that free speech needs to be qualified within the academic world (as Ezequiel seems to imply). Beyond purely formal conventions there is the issue of sound argumentation and substantive evidence among others, so that not any contribution is just as valuable as any other.

Now let me return to Sue's original remark and its context. It is all well and good to expect people to publish and to assess them on that basis when the system they work within supports this process, i.e. provides research grants, and full-time positions with few teaching contact hours and much time devoted to research. ELT has had a rather late entry into the academic arena as such, and research grants and full-time positions are rather thin on the ground. It is only lately that higher degrees have been created for ELT professionals and, as far as I am aware, do not exist at undergraduate level in the UK, but as a professional qualification (Certificate or Diploma). ELT has a tradition more closely related to that of an industry in which a service is delivered to clients, and therefore, the rules that apply are not the same.

I could go on for some time with other ideas related to this interesting issue, but that would turn this into a paper rather than a posting to the e-mail list, and each forum has its own rules!

Posted by: Cristina Banfi mailto:banfi@essarp.org.ar

** ---------------------------- 2. Pronunciation preferences ----------------------------

I've just received the IATEFL Newsletter "Issues" (issue No. 149) which focuses on the theme "The Changing Language". I found John Wells' contribution (pp.10-11) particularly enlightening as it reports the results of the 1998 LPD (Longman Pronunciation Dictionary) Pronunciation Preference Survey, based on answers from nearly 2,000 people from England, Wales and Scotland. Both this survey and the article in "Issues" are available at <http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/wells/poll98.htm>http://www.phon.ucl.a c.uk/home/wells/poll98.htm. I thought other list members might also find them interesting.

Posted by: Analia Kandel mailto:akandel@cvtci.com.ar

** -------------------------------------------------- 3. Request for info on joint ventures in Argentina --------------------------------------------------

I am now trying to make a list of all post-graduate courses in Argentina involving an Argentine on site location and a 'foreign' partner, in the fields of ELY, Translation (with English), English Literature and Applied Linguistics.

I have heard of of the following:

ELT related MAs

* Asociación Argentina de Cultura Inglesa (AACI) and Thames Valley University - on-site MA in TEFL * Universidad Nacional de Cuyo and a group of British Universities (Edinburgh, London and Manchester) - ??? * Universidad Nacional de La Plata and University of London, ?? * ICANA (Instituto Cultural Argentino Norte Americano) and the California State University (MA TESOL) * INSP en Lenguas Vivas J. R. Fernández and Victoria University of Manchester * Norwich Institute of Language Education and ???

Education related MAs

* INSP en Lenguas Vivas J. R. Fernández and University of London Institute of Education. * Universidad de San Andrés and University of Bath * Northlands School and University of Bristol (Graduate Education Management Programme)

Translation related MAs

* INSP en Lenguas Vivas J. R. Fernández and University of Birmingham * Colegio de Traductores Públicos de Buenos Aires and City University, London

Can anyone give more info on any of these and/or add to the list ?

Posted by: Martin Eayrs mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

** ---------------------------------------- 4. Should authors be paid for articles ? ----------------------------------------

I fully agree with the view that authors of articles should not claim payment for what they write. This keeps academic writing relatively unpolluted, and I say "relatively" because there are other contaminating agents such as the crave for prestige, the quest for a bulky CV or just competing for higher positions within academia, as Ms Laporte points out.

My articles do get published, and this has brought me nothing but satisfaction. It is marvellous to receive feedback from the readers, it is thrilling to know my ideas are being discussed at academic forums. For sure, I have learned more from the experience than my readers. I should pay THEM.

Ana María R. de Bergel <mailto:centum@datamarkets.com.ar>centum@datamarkets.com.ar

** --------------------------- 5. ELT Jobs in the new year ---------------------------

As teachers' minds turn to the new year and schools and teachers think about new staff or career changes remember our Argentina ELT Job shop page at http://www.eltnewsandviews.com.ar/jobshop/jobshop

This site has information both for teachers looking for work and also for institutions looking for staff. It is a wholly FREE sevrice and teachers and schools can post their requirements for a three month period.

List members (in fact anybody) are invited to make use of the ELT News & Views Jobshop Argentina at any time. Just send your request using the form on the website.

Posted by: List Editor mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

**

end

------------------------------ N&V-L Digest 503 - 28 Jul 1999 ------------------------------

....................................................... To repeat what others have said, requires education; to challenge it, requires brains. -- Mary Pettibone Poole .......................................................

There are 7 messages in this digest.

1. Should authors get paid for articles ? 2. Looking for AACI 3. Campus Federal Virtual 4. Useful website 5. Should authors get paid for articles ? 6. Should authors get paid for articles ? 7. MA Distance courses

**

---------------------------------------- 1. Should authors get paid for articles ? -----------------------------------------

Gosh, Sue Leather has started up an interesting discussion about whether people who write articles should get paid for them. I've ended up (thanks to Cristina and Ana Maria de Bergel) coming to the following conclusions:

1. Quality control is important however 'academic' or not a journal might be. Cristina's quite right there. But that's nothing to do with money.

2. I enjoy having articles published just as Ana Maria does!

3. When I've claimed payment for articles, however, I really don't feel my work has somehow been polluted (pace Ana Maria). Is teachers' methodology 'polluted' because teachers get paid? Are university researchers polluted because they get research grants? Heavens, are academics who write for journals 'polluted' by the pressure they are under to be published (and by the fact that they earn a salary)?

4. We probably need to make a difference between freelancers who don't receive salaries (that's me and Sue L, for example), and academics who do.

5. We all do things for free (both salaried workers and freelancers) from time to time and when it seems right (and, of course, sometimes for our own self interest). But NOT paying someone for their labour does not seem to me to be much of a virtue to be proud of. If everyone did that................

Postd by: Jeremy Harmer mailto:Jeremy.Harmer@btinternet.com

** ------------------- 2. Looking for AACI -------------------

I need to know an e-mail address from a well known institution in Argentina called Asociación Argentina de Cultura Inglesa. Can anybody send it to me?

Thanks in advance.

Poted by: Martin Inthamoussu mailto:inmir@adinet.com.uy

** ------------------------- 3. Campus Federal Virtual -------------------------

I read in the Clarín recently of and electronic network that is currently being set up that will connect virtually all educational institutions in the country - the Campus Federal Virtual .

I went to the Ministry web page at http://campus.rffdc.edu.ar/ where there is a smart logo and little else. Does anyone know anything else about this project - what it is, how it works, if it exists, even ??

Posted by: Michael Chang mailto:MiChang@hotmail.com

** ----------------- 4. Useful website -----------------

I think this information will be very useful for us teachers:

http://www.cup.cam.ac.uk/elt/dictionary

This is the web address of the Cambridge dictionaries. You can access definitions quite easily and quickly, so I think it's worth a visit.

Hope you find it useful too.

Posted by: Silvana Ferreyra mailto:domi@cvtci.com.ar

** ---------------------------------------- 5. Should authors get paid for articles ? -----------------------------------------

Hi again !

Nice debate going on at the moment. I have to say that, although it may not have looked like it in my previous posting, in principle (underlined), I do agree with the present system of "quality control" as described by Cristina. In fact, the point I was trying to make (quite unsuccessfully, as it turned out), was that in spite of the drag it means to sit down and write something worth publishing, and in spite of having to do it at odd hours when we are not running around with lectures, tutorials and markings, we still do it, and NOT for money.

We could also get into the debate about the fact that, with this "publish or perish" practice, we find a fair amount of papers that have been recycled over and over again, but that would be another story.

Posted by: Nadine Laporte mailto:n.i.laporte@bangor.ac.uk

** ---------------------------------------- 6. Should authors get paid for articles ? ----------------------------------------

I've been reading the ideas that have been contributed by some people, and I think it's time for me to join the fray.

It is true that most academic journals do not pay for contributions, but the fact that it is true does not make it right. What is more, the fact that this is both true and common practice does not rise the issue to a point of principle. That is the way it is, and it is that way, like it or perish (which will happen unless you publish, if the word on the street is right).

In what way does not paying help keep articles "unpolluted"? Would paying allow editors to select material according to their interests? That is already the case, since most journals are quite selectie as to what they publish. Would paying make writers go for quantity rather than quality? Well, I assume editors would be more careful as to what gets published if they are laying down some money for it, so the quality of the printed output would, if anything, raise together with standards.

On the other hand, a reality check, or rather two. 1) How do editors decide on who gets how much for what? 2) Can journals afford it? I do not know the answer to these two questions (Martin will answer "NO!" to the second, I guess), but I think the real problem lies here. Which brings me back to my opening statement: writers do not get paid because they do not get paid, not because any principle or ideological interest would suffer if they received money for their pains and research efforts.

Posted by: Pablo Toledo mailto:toledo@movi.com.ar

** ---------------------- 7. MA Distance courses ----------------------

Some colleagues and I are thinking of doing a distance MA in TEFL and we would like any information you might have. We know there are quite a few around but we only have the bumph from the University of Reading.

At the moment what we´d like to know is:

* Contents (very succintly) * Duration * On site/Distance regulations * Assessment criteria * Cost * Personal experience (is it good? would you recommend it? Why/why not? * advantages/disadvantages)

Any information is welcome.

Thanks a lot.

Posted by: Viviana Botti Barnett mailto:vbblcci@satlink.com

**

end

-------------------------------- N&V-L Digest 504 - 30 Jul 1999 -------------------------------- ....................................................... I read Shakespeare and the Bible, and I can shoot dice. That's what I call a liberal education. --Tallulah Bankhead .......................................................

There are 5 messages in this digest.

1. Should authors get paid for articles ? 2. More questions about payment for services 3. Looking for AACI 4. MA Distance courses in the UK 5. MA Distance Courses - an experience

**

---------------------------------------- 1. Should authors get paid for articles ? -----------------------------------------

Here's another twist on this question: I have recently learned from UK (psychology) lecturer friends that they are under pressure not to use photocopies of their articles in their lectures, *because the copyright belongs to the publishers*. In other words, you write an article, you don't get paid for it, and then if you want to use copies of it in your own classroom you can be taken to court by the people who didn't pay you for it. Apparently some American journals are getting quite shirty about this, and British universities are knuckling under for fear of legal proceedings.

I am not sure how I feel about getting paid for articles, but I do know how I feel about this new practice!

Posted by: Catherine Walter mailto:CWalter@compuserve.com

** -------------------------------------------- 2. More questions about payment for services --------------------------------------------

Like many list members, no doubt, I find the thread Sue Leather introduced on payment for articles (thanks Sue) very stimulating.

May I ask another question (and may I make it clear there is no hidden agenda to this): how do list members feel about pay sites on the Internet ?

ELT News & Views offers this list as a free service. We also offer on our web site a free calendar of events and an ELT job shop, and have plans to offer new services soon. (We are not altogether altruistic - we make our money, such as it is, on the printed magazine which many members of this list also subscribe to).

Now suppose you were asked to pay for the services you have been getting for free - how would you feel ? I ran this question by a couple of friends in a straw poll and the common feeling was 'well, I subscribe to N&V-L because it's free but no, I wouldn't pay for it'.

I took the decision to keep N&V-L non commercial (and that means we have no sponsor or funding) because I wanted an independent list, one that would allow anyone an equal voice no matter who they were or where they were coming from. For the same reason I wanted it to be free (no cost).

But many lists and websites provide similar services and charge for them. Are they wromg ? Is N&V-L a paragon of virtue blazing in the electronic wilderness or is it the way it should be ? Should the ELT News & Views web site start charging for the services it offers and the new ones it is about to introduce (on line data bases, search facilities for old lists and published articles) ? Should ELT News & Views swallow its pride along with its principles of independence and accept a sponsor ? Or should such services continue to depend on someone having the time, money and inclination to make them generally available ?

Opinions on this thread too, please.

Posted by: Martin Eayrs Publisher, ELT News & Views mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

** ------------------- 3. Looking for AACI -------------------

Here goes the e-mail addresses requested: email: <central@aacibsas.org.ar> and the web page is: http://www.aacibsas.org.ar .

Posted by: Stella Schulte mailto:stellaschulte@ciudad.com.ar

** -------------------------------- 4. MA Distance courses in the UK --------------------------------

A recent article in the EL Gazette lists the following UK universities as offering MAs by distance.

Aston Birmingham Institute of Education, London King's College, London Leicester Manchester (CELSE) Nile/UEA Reading (CALS) Sheffield Surrey (ELI) York

Check out the university websites for more information.

..................

Maria Victoria Saumell also sent some information as follows:

COURSE MSc. in ELT Management MA in ELT INSTITUTION University of Surrey FEES £ 6530 STRUCTURE 10 modules (3000 w.) + dissertation (8000-10000 w.) LENGTH 27 months ENTRY DATES March & October

COURSE MA in ELT Management INSTITUTION Chichester Institute of Higher Education

COURSE MA in Educational Management INSTITUTION University of Bath FEES £ 4000 STRUCTURE 6 modules (4000 w) + dissertation (15000-20000 w)

COURSE MEd in Educational Management INSTITUTION Northern College (Dundee) STRUCTURE 12 modules

COURSE MA in TEFL INSTITUTION University of Birmingham STRUCTURE 6 modules (4000 w) + dissertation (12000 w) LENGTH 30 months

COURSE MA in ELT INSTITUTION University of Manchester FEES £ 3300 LENGTH 30 months

COURSE MA in ELT (at AACI) INSTITUTION Thames Valley University FEES $9000 (30 x $280) STRUCTURE 6 modules (4000 w) + dissertation (12000 w) LENGTH 30 months

COURSE MA in TEFL INSTITUTION University of Reading FEES £ 4100 STRUCTURE 11 modules LENGTH 3 years ENTRY DATES May & November

COURSE MA in TEFL INSTITUTION Oxford Brookes University FEES £ 5500 STRUCTURE 20 modules LENGTH Up to 5 years ENTRY DATES March & September

COURSE MA in Applied Linguistics and TESOL INSTITUTION University of Leicester FEES £ 6000 STRUCTURE 5 modules (5000 w) + dissertation (20000 w)

Thanks too to Ron White for his suggestions.

Collated and posted by: Martin Eayrs mailto:me@eltnewsandviews.com.ar

** -------------------------------------- 5. MA Distance Courses - an experience --------------------------------------

Viviana Botti Barnett asks for information on MA distance courses. Although she apparently has a brochure of the MATEFL offered by the University of Reading, perhaps she --and other list members--might be interested in comments from people who are doing it.

After searching the Web and analysing what different institutions offered, I contacted CALS (Centre for Applied Language Studies) at the University of Reading last year and submitted my application to do it distance study. (I hope to do one of the Parts in England, however--perhaps next year). I started last November, although I had to stop for a few months due to numerous work commitments, and joined a new Cohort last May. I mention this because for very busy people it is extremely difficult sometimes to keep up with deadlines, so it's important to know there's more than one chance to do things (not that there's so much time allowed, but one can BREATHE once in a while, if you know what I mean!)

I chose the Reading MATEFL because its contents were the most interesting ones to me and because I found it offered a wide scope of different fields to specialise in. It was also interesting to be offered the chance of doing part of the course in England. I thought the organisation of the course sounded coherent and thorough, an extremely important point to my pragmatic little heart.

So far, that promise has been fulfilled, so I expect it will be the same with the rest. (Perhaps Analía Kandel can be more informative on this, since she has already completed the course-- The floor is yours, Analía). : )

The materials provided by CALS are excellent; there's constant on-line support, since we have our own electronic list (also of paramount importance --distance study can be very lonely sometimes); the suggested bibliography is also excellent; the possibility of getting copies of articles from the University of Reading library is a major advantage, I think; and last but not least, there's this feeling of being a person, not an e-mail address or a number: the response from tutors is immediate and comprehensive, and the feeling one gets is that they really try to reach out and be supportive and helpful.

All the information about contents, duration, cost, regulations, etc. can be found at the CALS Web site: <http://www.rdg.ac.uk/AcaDepts/cl/CALS/distance.html>, and any additional information can be obtained by email from Amanda Horn, the MA Course Administrator (<A.J.Horn@reading.ac.uk>) so I think it's unnecessary to mention all that here. That's why I'm only including my personal experience.

I would certainly recommend this course of studies, and the only disadvantage I have found has nothing to do with the university: it's the difficulty of finding in our country all the books suggested for further reading. I have solved that problem by ordering online from Amazon UK: they provide first class service, and the shipping costs are reasonable. The only snag is that sometimes it takes longer than the 10-14 days' usual period to get your books, and then you are faced with the problem of deadlines coming before the book! <: (

I'm trying to get around that, however. Perhaps asking CALS for a copy of the reading list of each course some time before the actual course starts...

Hope this helps, Viviana.

Posted by: Cristina Gallo Neuquen, Argentina mailto:cristina@newsystem.com

**

end

------------------------------ N&V-L Digest 505 - 31 Jul 1999 ------------------------------

[ Message transmitted at Internet Time @ 956 ]

...................................................... Knowledge that is acquired under compulsion obtains no hold on the mind. --Plato ......................................................

There are 5 messages in this digest.

1. Looking for Translation courses 2. Any Distance courses for translators ? 3. Training schools in Cordoba 4. APS at University of Surrey 5. More about payment for articles

**

---------------------------------- 1. Looking for Translation courses ----------------------------------

Hi! I'm subscribed to this cool site and I'd like to receive information about the places where I can study English Translation in Capital Federal. Furthermore, I would also be very grateful if you could send me the E-mail of INSP en Lenguas Vivas J. R. Fernandez (If it has one)

Thanks a lot in advance!!!

Posted by: Laura Sole+ mailto:Laura_sole@hotmail.com

** ----------------------------------------- 2. Any Distance courses for translators ? -----------------------------------------

I am a freelance simultaneous translator (Ing.-Port.- Ing.) with hundreds of hours of experience of interpreting (congresses, conferences, politics, etc.) and have been working this field in Fortaleza, NE Brazil for about three years.

I would like to know of ANY diplomas available through DISTANCE learning ... which are not Bachelor or Master's degrees but rather vocational qualifications with a low investment and shorter duration. I don't feel the need for training in interpreting, but rather something official-looking on paper to complement the good references of event organisers, etc.

Any suggestions would be very welcome! This field is LONELY in NE Brazil!!!!

Posted by: Graeme Clive Hodgson mailto:sky@fortalnet.com.br

** ------------------------------ 3. Training schools in Cordoba ------------------------------

I'm from Cordoba Capital and I was surprised to see that there wasn't any information about the Training Schools here. There are three places:

· (State) Escuela Superior de Lenguas-Universidad Nacional de Cordoba - Av. Velez Sarsfield 187, tel 4331073. I don't know details about the degrees, but I think there are a Profesorado, Traductorado and Licenciado en Literatura Inglesa.

· (Private) Instituto Sagrado Corazon.

· (Private) Instituto Juan Zorrilla de San Martin.

If you give me time, I can find out about the last two institutions - address and telephone number -, because I couldn't find them in the Telephone Directory. I'm curious: aren't there any teachers from Cordoba in the list? Apart from Julio Jimenez's message, I've never read a message from a Cordobese teacher!. Posted by: Ma. Victoria Tejerina Allende de Villagra mailto:villagra@nt.com.ar

** ------------------------------ 4. APS at University of Surrey ------------------------------

After a two year search for a masters which was NOT Ed Management nor ELT I happily found the APS at UniS . There are several advantages. I'm talking personally of course.

· It's more related to human resource development than anything I've seen. · The menu is modular and DIFFERENT. · It's applied..........really. · There are two assignments per module · It's pure distance if you want . · The on-line study guides are superb and the recommended readings extensive. · There's an IT pathway. · You can apply for APEL. · You are in constant contact with your Tutor. · You get up to 5 years to finish (necessary if you've got a family and you work full time) · You can exit at cert or dip level. · The modules I've seen so far (Theories of Learning, The Ed role of the Trainer, Teaching and Learning methods and Leadership in Ed, plus the compulsory Research module) are quality in design. It's a struggle to work alone but very challenging and with such excellent material very rewarding. I feel there's such a need for this kind of approach that it would be worthwhile for others to take a look at it Posted by: Susan Hillyard mailto:hillyard@ciudad.com.ar

** ---------------------------------- 5. More about payment for articles ----------------------------------

Catherine Walter raises a very important issue. As I said before, I am in favour of not paying for academic articles, but I also believe that the author should keep the copyrights. With no pay, nothing is being sold. I would definitely keep the N&VL free of charge and independent (I will not say "unpolluted" again), but the other types of Websites should also exist. The problem is not so much how many or what kinds of options there are, but whether we can choose what is best for us. In the 21st century, education will have to strengthen the individual's capabilities for making choices, considering that with technological developments, the worlds's the limit. I do not fully see the parallel Mr Harmer draws between teaching and writing academic articles. Teaching is clearly a service supplied by a professional to a client. Is writing the same thing ? This has given me food for thought.

Ana María R. de Bergel mailto:centum@datamarkets.com.ar

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